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Drivers for early evening and all the daytime time trains would also help with the basic mission of a railway. And as for all northbound trains from 2228 onwards, ".may be subject at alteration..", ie not there at all. A bit more commitment to run a railway late evening would often be appreciated.

More than mere detail of the new trains, we now have an operating photo!
Shiny, fresh logo's, quieter, no Metro's on the floor (yet), no graffiti (yet), no feet on seats (yet) but unfortunately no announcement at Aly Paly to say you're on the Hertford line, or not, so expect a few more of those unfortunate incidents where the scenery doesn't look as usual and the noise of the tracks a tad different to previous times and you end up having to wind your way back from wherever. (My personal best was a non stop to WGC , arriving there 23:30.)

...and here's a short video about the new trains.



PS Don't try mimicking the cover shot yourself!

It's pretty easy to tell whether or not you're on a Hertford Loop train at Ally Pally: if you're on platform 6 with vegetation on your left and the platform on your right, you are; if you aren't you're not. That's aside from the announcements and indicator boards wherever you got on and at intervening stations.

On my way home from work I once got on a train at Kings X expecting to change at Finsbury Park. Unfortunately, it was one of two trains with the same departure time, and this one had first stop Royston. When we arrived there I got off, only to hear an announcement that all trains to London were halted due to a stuck level crossing. Fortunately, within half an hour they managed to unstick it and I managed to get back to PG without having to face a ticket inspector (I was using a Zone 1-4 travelcard).

Bill’s obviously a lot smarter than me but in our defence (for I certainly wasn’t the only one that evening who mistakenly ended up in WGC) the KX announcements and boards were wrong (this being when our evening trains started there). And once out of FPK the train didn’t stop at Ally Pall to check where the vegetation was!
Broken down train at Drayton Park this afternoon required rerouting to KX and delayed things by about an hour. No mention if it was new variety of train or simply an old continuing to struggle. Possibly the wrong sort of snow on the tracks, or threat of.

I don’t want to get too excited but I thought I saw indicator boards INSIDE the train telling you the next station stop. Really? After all this time of tweeting and complaining about not being able to see station signs after dark and asking for driver announcements, maybe GNR actually listened? However there was no mention of this from Geoff so I don’t want to get my hopes up....In the meantime, we will still have to put up with this problem. Does anyone know why the driver can’t announce the approaching station?

It looks as if we may be waiting some time for new trains to be running on the line; there is apparently a blind spot from the driver's cab preventing them from viewing the whole platform. Govia and the unions aren't in agreement on a workaround solution until new signalling is introduced on the line (which is unlikely to be for at least a couple of years). In the meantime, the current trains are barely being maintained, as they were supposed to be out of service by now.

I assume that James' source is the Mail on Sunday article headlined "£200million train cab where drivers can't see out the window: Station signals obscured from the seat and views blocked by a wall housing the safety ladder put passengers in danger"

I found a thread on a train enthusiasts' forum discussing the problem with people posting to it on the whole pretty gloomy about the prospects for the new trains appearing any time soon and for the current trains - having been so badly neglected - surviving for much longer. There was speculation about all services being diverted into Kings X for some considerable time. Supposedly, no-one dare do anything to the signals in the tunnel because the whole system is so fragile.

However, earlier today someone posted the following:

The plan appears to be to have dispatchers at all stations in the tunnel, then, once all the current trains have been withdrawn, to install barriers at the danger point on the platforms, which they can't do while the 313 class is still running. As the man said, "Let's see!"

If this is chaotic as it appears to be, then some sackings would seem to be in order.

The company is a complete shambles. Error after error after error.

Sources were that story from the Mail that you mentioned - risky I know – but also the rail forum too, which seems a more reliable source of information.

If you want to blame any one then its down to Railtrack when the units were ordered it was with the understanding that the signalling between Drayton park and Moorgate would be modernised to in cab signalling so line side signals would not be necessary , but as usual Railtrack failed to deliver the old right and left hand scenario , drivers have to observe starting signals at stations are clear for them to proceed, as the 717s are a fixed 6 car formation and slightly longer the driver has to stop right at the end on the platform so can no longer see the signal, its like stopping at traffic light with signal post by your passenger door, the drivers reps have suggested either having a second person in the cab between Drayton Park and Moorgate assist in signal observation or a repeater signal be placed in such a place so the driver can see it, but as usual, as its not managements idea so reluctant to adopt it, their idea was to stop the train a coach length short and selective close the doors on the last coach so if you are in it you have move forward to get out at these stations, to me it another Grayling cock up as the GTR is not privatised it is owned by the MoT as all revenue goes to them, GTR are only paid to manage it and their ability to so it is debatable.

Thanks. Sounds like it is the infrastructure owner's fault then - and your note perhaps explains why the signalling in the tunnels seems to fail consistently. Just one correction - Railtrack ceased operating in 2010 - the infrastructure owner is Network Rail.

This photo was tweeted last week by @13milpost, along with this text:

Contributors to railforums.com seem confident that the trains will come into service on Monday! "We're looking at 2 units in service weekdays only for a few weeks then 2 units entering service every 2 weeks."

Interesting!
But I thought GTR was owned by Keolis, a French and Canadian Company, and The Go-Ahead Group, based in Germany and the UK??? Not that I want to absolve Failing Grayling in any way. I heard that the Hertford Loop was about to become part of the wonderful London Overground system but Grayling blocked that as he didn't want it to fall into the hands of socialists.

it's "official", or at least confirmed by today's ES. Lets hope they come with their own drivers.

Slightly disappointing news - it rather spoils my hand-crafted joke about the new rolling stock - like Brexit, promised but not delivered.....
I found myself on one of the new trains the other day. Very few folk aboard, and my sensitive rear parts registered quite a lot of bouncing around as we clattered over the points. But it was nice to have the electronic display telling us where we were going and which station we had reached. And of course, the seats were clean, not many passengers having put up their feet yet.......

I have just indulged in a return trip on the new trains (10.55 from PG, 13.25 from Moorgate). Off-peak of course and not many passengers, but what immediately struck me when I boarded was how close together the airline-style seats are. There's very little leg-room and the back of the seat in front is right in your face. If you have long legs and/or baggage you're in for a cramped trip. This detracted from the otherwise roomy and open-plan feel of the train. I found myself seeking the facing pairs of seats (there aren't many) or one of the few inward-facing, Overground-style seats by the doors. The seats are pretty hard, too.

The free wifi is easy to get on to, and pretty quick, though it doesn't work underground (confusingly, your device would indicate you have a signal, but you're only connected to the train's wifi, not the outside world). On the return I appeared to reconnect automatically, but it didn't work. I had to forget the network then reconnect. There are three-pin sockets between each pair of seats, but no USB points, so if you need to recharge a device you must have a plug with you as well as a cable.

The audio and visual station announcements are welcome and worked fine. The door alert sirens are quite harsh but otherwise the ride was smooth and quiet, with no annoying compressor rattle (the suspension seemed stiffer, but that's maybe down to the firm seats). The power switchover at Drayton Park is considerably less dramatic, almost unnoticeable.

Overall it was a pleasant experience, like travelling on the Overground but with a different seat layout.

Passengers in a crowded peak-time train may, of course, have a completely different view...

I board the 07.21 train every morning and the new trains have far fewer seats than the old ones so it's standing room only now . This is obviously a design just to pack even more people in without any thought of passenger comfort. This is not helped by the time table changes which leave us with no train for sixteen minutes prior to the 07.21.

The best thing about the old trains was the fact that there were no announcements. Everywhere you go these days there is music or some other noise distraction. It was a real tonic that you would have a relatively peaceful trip home. I am now less likely to get a seat as a result of the removal of a good many of them and this is not a good start as my job requires me to stand most of the day.
Having said that I am of average height and find the leg room perfectly adequate and the seats comfortable enough.

I thought no announcements nor any screens was an absolute pain!

Winter peak time travel, with the windows opaque with condensation, it was impossible to know where along the line you were unless stood in eyeshot of the opening doors on constantly checking google maps on your phone.

Interesting feedback on this forum vis a vis many others I've seen where commuters seem delighted for all the additional room. Plugs another added 21st century bonus.

In last night’s total timetable carnage (start of a significant holiday week and presumably absolutely no margin in driver numbers so as to maximise profits irrespective of collateral damage to mere users), round the corner tootled a new train. So to add to Denis’ thesis I’d add: very bright headlights, priority seats with covers different to standard seats, a fire extinguisher under a seat near the door (useful for fires, or as often happened back at school, to make someone’s clothing all wet and foamy), a small red light above the doors so you know where they are in the dark and a very beepy door closing beeper. The journey seemed quieter, beeper aside. Just wish there was enough drivers to run the timetabled service.